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Last update for (2)Hootchie : 2008, 06, 06 00:17
mapIDMapname (comments)map sizeAuthorRatingTypeplay type
2982 (2)Hootchie 128*128SiaBBo0.9betaground

The map has been rated 48 times and got a total of 42 points
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Comments:   GMCS (1 elements)


SiaBBo
I tried make ash map again. Any suggestions?

Mineral blocks are 24.
MorroW
remove the doodad that blocks reds nat from making a scanner -.-

deco should be better, more doodads and so

the middle expands are kinda useless since it will be almost impossible to expand there

that minblock is huge -.- please just remove it or at least make them to 16 or 8
SiaBBo
Better deco is coming. I was just so tired.

Added double gas middle exps.
modified by SiaBBo
MorroW
its strange that u actually remove the min-block just cuse i say so, maybe u should have waited to see what others mappers think :S anyway i like this better now ^^
SiaBBo
Well, even i didnt like it. First version main's minerals could shoot. So i added that mineral block
MorroW
the opening to the mid to nat is kinda open, 3rax vs z will be very effective.

u should make it alittle tighter or put neutralbulding/mineralblock at the sides (like reverse temple something)
Lancet
I like it! The backdoor creates an access that cuts the main/nat unit in two, deadly if your enemy takes control of that access route, but at the same time the center has the big price of the double gas expos. I would also increase the number of minerals or their value in the center to reinforce the importance of these expos because players could just "play it safe" and expand to the corner expos for third gas. I would make it such that if a player takes firm control of one of these central expos he is likely to win.
SiaBBo
Ok, deco is better now.. More comments or suggestions?

I added one more mineral middle exps and removed 1 corner exps.
modified by SiaBBo
MorroW
siabbo tell me why u wont:
make it alittle tighter or put neutralbulding/mineralblock at the sides (like reverse temple something)

:S
SiaBBo
Happy?
MorroW
i wont play the map...
im just here to help you ;P

ask ur self if ur happy
SiaBBo
I'm happy. But are you?

^^
modified by SiaBBo
MorroW
yes im happy thank you ^^
Nightmarjoo
Mains are huge, main2nat distance is huge, I think the backdoor was executed poorly and will have little effect on most games, except make pvz nearly impossible and tvz annoying. Oh, and create pathing issues later on if it's still there. I guess it makes tvp nearly impossible too. Terran has to go like 2fact tanks just to TRY to expo. Protoss can go 3gate goon pressure every game and win, because terran will never expo. And protoss can just, take the map.

I mostly agree with morrow about the middle expos being fairly useless. In general, flanking is really stunted all-over, which of course hurts balance.
The middle'd make it t>p if terran could take his nat, but he can't, so it's not. It'd help pvz (but map'd still be z>p) if protoss could take his nat, but he can't, so it doesn't. It makes it hard on terran, which only furthers z>t. I can't imagine how hard it will be to fight lurker/swarm in that middle. That's if terran gets to lategame. Mutalisks are so fucking strong on this map it's ridiculous, on top of terran not being able to FE, which already basically makes the map impossible for tvz. Terran basically has to try to win with 3rax +1 every game, if he fails he loses the game since he can't expo. Even if he's marginally successful he'll probably lose once mutalisks are out, if he can't kill zerg.

p>t z>p z>t badly. Overall there really isn't anything I like in the map ._.
SiaBBo
I dont understand why you say it is p>t. Terran can make barracks+depot to natural and it is pretty good stopper. Then make some tanks?

Or do I miss something?
SiaBBo
I do that what is in GMCS.

I think it was good idea, cuz now main is smaller. I didn't add gas there.
MorroW
TVP: explenation
protoss just does this "proxi" in his nat with his 2gate and if t does his wall in nat its nat to nat distance with goons. that distance is pretty short for 1fac fe + wall in nat vs 2goon.

the dragoons will be many more than the terran can defend. it will be 1goon vs 0 tank, 3 goon vs 1 tank, 3 goon vs 2 tank, 5 goon vs 2 tank. anyway my point is distance = short + no ramp.

this doesnt make tvp imba no, terran can expand but its just that if protoss expand terran cant stop it cuse the main to nat distance is so long and as u alrdy know t cant proxi factory like p can ^^

and terran cant 1fac fe so this pretty much always will be:
2fac vs protoss fe or 2fac vs 2gate. terran can only do 1 thing and that isnt much for a "good" gameplay and besides protoss will never get surprised of what he really meets. well terran can also fast siege drop nat ^^

before i thought it was the same with tau cross but now i learned it isnt, this distance is longer

TVZ: why its muta vs 3rax ^^
and what it comes to this mu mutalisk will be very very powerful cuse:
- distance to nat is so long
- very hard to build turrets behind the nat
- and ofcourse the mains arent in a corner.

and how do we stop 2 or 3 hatch muta?, 3rax is effective from my experianse and at a map like this if he does 2rax he will never be able to expand cuse mutas will harass everything so incredible good (like pos 2oclock at luna)
so the only chanse is to 3rax but that would mostly fail too.
SiaBBo
Terran should make bunker and marines. ^^
MorroW
wouldnt work neither
Nightmarjoo
Morrow terran can't take his nat because of the backdoor. Without the backdoor, it would just be really hard, with the backdoor, it's impossible.
SiaBBo

modified by SiaBBo
Nightmarjoo
lol
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