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Noob question: What is cheese? On some maps I've seen some comments like "those cliffs are kinda 'cheese'", or "it allows for 'cheese tanks'."
2006, 10, 17 02:59
terrain features that allow units to be used very very cost effectively, but in game terms its pretty much anything that is "all or nothing"

example: scv rush
4 pool

so when they say "cliff can be tank cheesed" they mean putting a tank on the cliff so you have to get a shuttle and it can delay your mining time a lot too just because of 1 dumb tank.
2006, 10, 17 03:24
can rush is considered cheese, too, and bunker rush was as well sometime. But it became so common, can you still call it cheese?
Cheese usually is something that is off the norms (you enemy hopefully doesn't expect it), you are accepting some risks when cheesing, but often inflict horrible damage.

Some more cheese I can think of: offgates, offrax, offhatch, and other off-..., bunker rush on protoss or terran, cloaked wraith on protoss, pylon prisons, manner pylons, manner depots, manner rax...
2006, 10, 17 06:18
Someone can add this to "glossary written by panschk[FP]" in the article section.
2006, 10, 17 07:04
did you ever see manner depots? :D
modified by Antares
2006, 10, 17 20:40
2006, 10, 17 21:34
Dunaj tactics!
Half the pimpest plays are nice cheese :)
2006, 10, 17 21:34
Cheese is basicly ending the game in 3 mins or so. In order to do that, the player attempts to use everything he has (workers) to inflict as much damage as possible. Good examples of cheese strategies are: bunker rush, proxy gates, offensive sunkens (zvz, yes, building your sunkens on enemy creep), manner pylon, manner-etc., "drone" drill, etc. etc. All these strategies tend to end the game very quickly, and thats the purpose of a cheese.

nuff said.
2006, 10, 18 01:10
no, thats what whiners turned cheese into. Cannon rush definetly is not a cheese, neither is bunker rush. I have seen bunker rushes completely fail and terrans still win. I have also seen cannon rsuhes to compliment a FE. it diverts zergs attention while you tech with high macro.
Manner pylon? since when does that end games quickly. barely ever bothers me. just jump your workers.

Cheese is DO OR DIE. 4 pool if it fails unless you do some hella damage your screwed.
2006, 10, 18 02:03
I'd say that do-or-die is do-or-die, and cheese is cheese. Imo cheese is basically playing far off the norms, with high risk indeed, but not always do-or-die, imo it's more like if it fails, you had great expenses (money and micro) without doing any damage, but if it succeeds, you have gotten much from it.
That's my opinion, and I don't think anyone can say that he knows an exact definition of cheese, because there IS NONE.

Manner-Depot-thingies were often played on Bifrost3, like blocking your enemies choke for some reason, or sometimes combined with a barracks at the ramp behind your minerals, and similar stuff.

I guess you can call a depot to prevent a zerg from taking his fe a manner depot, too, but this is certainly no cheese ;)
2006, 10, 18 08:20
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