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Bridges10 of October 2006 12:59 AM
Posted by:Nightmarjoo
"Especially P does not like the bridge.

How many zealots woud be neaded to block the bridge? at least 4. How many zealots would be needed to block a ramp? 2 is sufficient. This gives huge difference because if P plays one gate build order, it should produce at least 2 more zealots than other normal map. 2 more zealots costs as much as 1 cyber which means slower tech-up.

Then protoss would hardly choose one gate build order, which means there are only two choices: forge double nexus and two gate build order. Two gate push is ruled out because this map does not have nat exposed to the outside and distance between the bases are too far. The only choice would be double nexus.

Luckily this map is double nexus favorable because it has nat inside and it is quite hard to get through the bridge in if cannons are standing near the bridge.

However the worst thing about bridge is that it is hard to go out. If mass forces would want to move out of the base, it would be jammed on the bridge(especially those stupid dragoons). What if T's siege tanks or Z's lurkers waiting at the other side of brigde? They will be crushed.

And T does not like the bridge also because they cannot block the entrance. Well, these days, T players defend so well that they can defend most of P's push in the beginning but still it is true that bridge gives hard time.

Since the 11/7 o'clock base does not have high grounded base, we cannot use ramp. The typical open-type map gives protoss chance to do double nexus. I mean double nexus outside of the base not the inside like this map. It needs nat outside of the base and some space that can be defended by well-designed sim city. Unfortunately this map does not satisfy such properties.

And the design of main base seems to be problematic. Those basilica does nothing tactical in this map; it just block the space to build buildings. And overall space of main base seems to be small.

Generally it is not a good idea to mix high-grounded base and open-type base, because the two kinds of bases have too different features that makes almost impossible to make balance between them" - Diminate

I think this is a good explanation of why bridges suck as chokes. This does not mean that normal sized bridges should not be used. On the contrary they should be used, but with consideration to the effects of using bridges.

Please comment on this to add to the wisdom of why bridges are gay.
Comments:

NastyMarine
Jungle Bridges:

-Can be 'unit walled' with two zealots.
-Can be 'builing walled' off using buildings.

Space Bridges:

-Cannot be walled off efficiently without modifications.

Twilight Bridges:

-Can be 'unit walled' with two zealots.
-Can be 'builing walled' off using buildings.

Badlands Bridges:

-Can be 'unit walled' with two zealots.
-Can be 'builing walled' off using buildings.

Ice Bridges:

-Can be 'unit walled' with two zealots.
-Can be 'builing walled' off using buildings.

Desert Bridges:

-Can be 'unit walled' with two zealots.
-Can be 'builing walled' off using buildings.

also not mentioned, it's not adviced to place long bridges as main chokes, but the smaller ones are ok. Modifiying bridges to be smaller (thinner or shorter) is probobly best for any main choke, but for jungle, the smallest bridge should be ok
flothefreak
even bridges you CAN wall with two zealots aren't as efficient as a ramp. firstly, it is no longer a top-vs-bottom-fight (66% chance of being hit), secondly, you'll be able to get FOUR zerglings to attack those two zeals, instead of 3 versus ones on a ramp. (last point iirc)
spinesheath
The biggest problem of bridges is that they form a long choke. The longer the choke, the more your units seperate, and the easier they get killed when leaving the bridge one-by-one.
Of course wide bridges such as space bridges add more problems.
Nightmarjoo
:) such as spines? Bare in mind that these articles are intended to help the litte guy learning or bettering mapping skills
inept
who needs blocking anyway? i dont see people blocking on bloodbath. and omGZ TEH BRIDGE!1!! CHOKE!1

seriously its not a big deal unless your using those horrid thin jungle bridges
spinesheath
I obvously meant things that were already mentioned: A space bridge on a standard map (64x64 is a LITTLE different :p ) obviously is too wide for the usual bos.
EffectHypnotize
wtf?
panschk[FP]
spam cleared...
dario

modified by Freakling
SpoRe
FYI, you can wall normally (2 depots 1 rax) on space bridges. Its just not intuitive and looks odd or like it doesnt work.

Here is an example http://www.panschk.de/mappage/comments.php?mapid=4697

http://www.panschk.de/mappage/pics/4697.jpg

All of these bases can wall with 2 dep, 1 rax.

The white tile is an approximate guideline as to where to place the buildings.

Top Left, is pretty straight forward. Rax on left of bridge, 2nd depot snuggled right next to bridge/rax, or 1 tile back even. 3rd depot directly to the right of that

Top Right, is almost a mirror of top left, although you can copy it (not mirror), doing so will make your marines spawn outside.

Bot Left, is a where it gets fucky. Rax has to be back away from the edge of the bridge (but touching the space edge below/right), 1st depot has to be sort of diagonal up and left from it, and finally 2nd depot diagonal up and snuggled next to edge and bridge.

Bot Right, is the most complicated. There is no way to place it standard without that hole thrown to the right of the bridge (although in this case it helps with the tank range balance of the map). So in this instance, the rax has to go to the left of the bridge. The 1st depot goes to the right and up a little, and the 2nd depot snuggles next to the hole and the bridge.

edit - better pic http://i21.tinypic.com/n53lth.jpg
modified by SpoRe
dario

modified by Freakling
dario

modified by Freakling
dario

modified by Freakling
dario

modified by Freakling
dario

modified by Freakling
tktkvroom
dario stop doing drugs man
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