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Last update for (2)War of the Roses : 2008, 07, 30 07:19
mapIDMapname (comments)map sizeAuthorRatingTypeplay type
3175 (2)War of the Roses 128*128anotak0.1betaground

The map has been rated 49 times and got a total of 5 points
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Comments:   GMCS (0 elements)


anotak
this is my first map i've uploaded.
i realize it sucks but i don't know how to do better quite yet.

I have a feeling that balance-wise T>P but I don't really know. And I'm not 100% sure I'd know how to fix it.

opinions?
modified by anotak
neobowman
Why don't you use inverts for the main's ramps? Deco is bad and it looks really open. If you use SCMdraft, you should use the mirror tool.
anotak
yeah, maybe i should use inverts for those. hmm, i'll mess around with it.

Mirror Tool? where is this? I use scmdraft but i haven't seen that anywhere in it, looking around i can't find it.

also after making this map i realize that downward/upward facing minerals suck ass.

also my mains are too big.

edit: oh i just figured out the mirror thing i think if you mean the mirror-x mirror-y mirror-xy thing?
modified by anotak
Nightmarjoo
So you're gonna map now? Now you'll learn why everyone ends up hating me at some point, as I comment maps draconically :)

Yes that's the mirror tool. It's useful, to avoid positional differences such as different sized mains, etc, without counting squares. We've all tried counting squares before for perfect symmetry, and you learn nothing from it, it's just tedious and breaks your motivation, so there's no reason not to use the symmetry tool if it can help.

Once positional balance is out of the way, you get to focus on the layout and structure of the map. I'd start at the mains and nats, that's what I always work on first when I make a map atleast. Try and make a less awkwardly shaped main and nat, while positioning the ramp, starting location, and the minerals themselves better.

A lot of things "work" fine in starcraft, but that doesn't mean they're comfortable. Look at your nats, they'll work fine, but they're kind of awkward. Note: in zvt zergs will have to be more worried about their nats, mnm can easily run past sunks for red, and the geyser position of blue makes covering the whole nat with sunks hard with just three or four sunks. It's hard to place turrets in case of muta. Since blue's main is more open just behind the minerals, he'll be better off since he can place his barracks there, and turret the barracks and nat lines from the main at the same time, red will be hard pressed to do the same.

There's a lot of irregular stuff amidst the positional differences (read: imbalances), like things being placed not even close to being proportionately symmetrical, sizes being radically different, red being in the corner blue being near the middle of the map, etc.

Your expo layout feels chaotic. There's no order in it, no strategical importance in any of them outside of distance.

To be particularly harsh, it seems to me that you didn't consider gameplay at all when you made the map, you just placed stuff while kind of keeping in mind what a map needs. You need to have some kind of plan when you make a map, specifically placing things with relation to other things so that it makes sense. Distances, sizes, shapes, are all important. The map lacks a concept imo, it looks to just be a random assortment of things. I don't know what you expect gameplay to be like, how the map will play, what's good and bad about the map, what players will like and dislike, etc.

For a first map this is perfectly fine, it's much better than my first map. The first maps I uploaded to this site are far better than my first maps too, and they're terrible, and worse than this, so you're doing ok.

I reccomend not spending a lot of time on this map. I think it's probably important and helpful to work on it a bit more, for practice's sake, just to fix it up as much as possible before scrapping it and starting something new, with new knowledge, skills, and experience.

I'd start by figuring out what you want in the map, and placing it with the symmetry tool. After that, it'll be much easier to specifically address features of the map.
anotak
Thank you, that was exactly the sort of response I was looking for :D

I've always made maps, I just either never thought any of them were worth anything (much worse than even this map) or I never finished them.

You're also right about there being very little thought behind it, it just came about with me randomly throwing down terrain at first, which got formed into the raised jungle later.

As soon as the mirror tool was mentioned I started working on another map that I had a more specific, albeit still vague idea for a map that I thought of... I'll maybe post it if I finish it.

Thanks again :D
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