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Last update for (4)Ruins Of Bahigar : 2005, 11, 07 00:13
mapIDMapname (comments)map sizeAuthorRatingTypeplay type
653 (4)Ruins Of Bahigar 128*128GooseBoy0.9final

The map has been rated 56 times and got a total of 50 points
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Comments:   GMCS (0 elements)


GooseBoy
My most recent addition to my arsenal. I only try to make original maps, and this was a fair result of one of them. Also, i need a better base layout for bottom bases, if someone can help me plz. Thank you =)
flothefreak
often, originality ends up being imbalance...
but well, don't want to write everything again. look at my comment on shout of silence.
Your Name
comment about MY map, thank you.
GooseBoy
lol why that always happens, that was me.
LGI
Is this 128x128 or bigger, because the jpg is a little strange...
GooseBoy
128 x 128, are you guys gonna help me with the map or not?
Listoric
Do you think that some of us may have a real life and aren't here all day?

Ok, why 2 entrances? There isn't enough space for Terran or Protoss to build a base in the startinghole, so they have to go up, but there are two entrances, which is very hard to defend against Z or P. Also you can't build a FE to cover your choke as Zerg (which isn't necessary on every map) but alaways a god attempt for a nice map. delete the second entrance.

Next thing is the extra gas at the "natural". Zerg will love you for that because zerg needs the most gas "early". Mutas and Lurkers need a lot. The other races will take the gas too maybe, but it's not that gift as it is for zerg. delete the second gas.

Then you could add an island expansion on 12 and 6 o'clock. this is especially good for PvZ, as known.

I opened your map with staredit and had several errors on startup, so check that also.

The mainbase mineralline should always be accessable with units, so that probes don't get stuck behind the minerals as well as tanks or goons gant be dropped there. Meleeunits should always have the chance to defend the base also. Also the Reavers scarabs need this hole to "work correctly", and not get stuck.

Finally read yourself through the article: The Gas Issue - Part 1 & 2 in our Articles section on the left hand, to see, how the geysirs, especially on mainbase, should be set.

Except that, the map looks nice. You used all sorts of terrain, good use of doodads, just looks sweet.

Listoric
As i've seen you comment on other maps that they are "the same" somehow. This is just because mapmaking follows some rules. In Starcraft, almost EVERY map is "playable and fun" to a certain degree. I could also create a map with 4 isles, 4 mineralblocks, 3 geysirs and thats it, also fun to play, and "new and different".

Still it would be a bullshit map in the end. A "real" map follows some rules, that can be changed and varied somehow, still there is a strict concept to them.

In Starcraft these concepts are the following (i try to sum them up somehow):

- mainbase with 1 gas and ~8 mineralfields
- dropping/harassing space behind the mineralline
- "hole" in the mineral line to assist defending and attacking
- gasnode on left or top side of the mainbase
- one main entrance
--> blockable with 2 supply depots + 1 barracks as maximum amount of buildings (on a ramp)
--> on maps with the same height level, one barracks wallin
- natural expansion in front of/near the choke
- natural expansion with 1 gas and ~8 mineralfields
- blablabla i will continue this list with an article later i think...

but you know what i'm talking about.

Just think about one thing: There are hundreds of fresh ideas which are NOT used in starcraft mapmaking, because hundreds of them are total bullshit.
flothefreak
oh lis
I had much more fun answering him :D
flothefreak
I'd wish there would have been a few more maps where he'd commented the same thing. oh, no, it's of course not the same thing! the ones that were the same weren't his posts but the usermaps!
tronicc
It look all the same
NoNamedOne
btw lis dont think the blockable entrance shud be 100% at all map, i had seen realy muth map whits dont have blockable entrance(even in korean leagues etc.), if the mainbases isnt too neer its posible to defend it(perheps there is only 1r amp to etner your main, but it cant be blockted)
flothefreak
yeah, but entrances like that have to fit in the map, and should only be made for balancing reasons. If not, well, then the entrances are first, and the map must be created to equalize that
GooseBoy
oh k. finnaly i got helpfull posts. i was thinking about removing the second ramp or changing the lower level of start positions to higher level. also i woud like to clarify the gas nat issue. That gas is covered with 5 minerals each, with 120 ore each. and that gas has only 1000 gas so isnt that so helpfull for zerg as someone said above. I yust made that cuz theres no other gas expo in the map. above all that, i yust wanted some ppl to know me cuz all the maps i post here goes into an empty space where no one post something rly helpfull about them, or they only say: "Imbalanced", or "Fix it", or "Nice map, but theres some issues..." etc etc. for example, look at some posts above, the thing that posted flothefreak, is that of any help? I yust want you to say whats wrong with the map and I will fix it with pleasure, so i can keep improving and adding more maps to this site and contributing to this community. But i was gettin really pissed off, so im sorry if my "unoriginal" posts arround caused some trouble, my forgiveness.
GooseBoy
Map image has been updated.
flothefreak
may I quote myself?
here we go:

"often, originality ends up being imbalance...
but well, don't want to write everything again. look at my comment on shout of silence."

I told you to read that mentioned comment, which was about general things in mapmaking. but instead of only LOOKING ONE TIME IF IT'S USEFUL, you let it aside and complained you wouldn't get any help, like a whinign child. if you are not willing to _just_ open up a simple new browser tab with a helping comment, you're not really caring about improving your map.
GooseBoy
I read it. That has nothing to do with my map. I know that post u made is right and u are right about it. it's yust that it has nothing to do with it here.
flothefreak
welcome to the quirly quoting show!
let's pick the parts that hit particularly your map!

almost every part of a map influences balance a lot. (just think of 2 ramps to the mainbase :O )

there are hundreds of thoughts that you should have while creating a map, in order to prevent one race having large advantages.

furhtermore, you should provide every player the same chances in starting positions. the same difficulty or easiness in covering the mains' ramp/choke with the natural expansion, the same way and layout of the 2nd expansion (most time a minonly) etc
(your map: some can cover entrance with natural expo easier than others. ramps BEHIND the 2nd expo (minonly) are on top more away than on bottom positions. this expo can be backed up from the mainbase at bottom, on top you can't)

balance and fair positions, that are the things you should learn at first...

blubb
tronicc
The whole map suck srry if I'm harsh but your main base type is bad as well as your 2 entrance idea.. Really original maybe this is what differs from the other maps that you say "they all look the same"
GooseBoy
flothefreak i thought u meant that bridge thing u posted =P not that.
GooseBoy
look, lets forget all this, what i did was wrong. Im going to post again this map and lets all forget what yust happened here. Erease your minds and none of you remembers what happened. End of discussion.
Listoric
Actually i really hope you stop this bullshit, flothefreak as well as GooseBoy.

It helps just NOTHING if someone offends the other, NOTHING and NOONE. So STOP this bullshit immediatly.

IF you want to argue, then post your icq or email accounts and then discuss there. or in the forum, but THIS is just awesome dumb shit.

Now, back to topic...
GooseBoy
lol listoric thats actually what i want =P
Listoric
I know, jsut wanted to sum it up again :P
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