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Last update for (4)Muse 1.5 : 2006, 11, 11 16:39
mapIDMapname (comments)map sizeAuthorRatingTypeplay type
1618 (4)Muse 1.5 128*128Nightmarjoo and Spinesheath-5.9final

The map has been rated 44 times and got a total of -259 points
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Comments:   GMCS (4 elements)


SynDrome
experiment5al ramps asap
Nightmarjoo
here's my newest map. It's the first in a few months, I had been doing more playing than map making, and when I tried to make a map I couldn't think of anything. Well, I've been working on this on and off for a week or two, yesterday I found my muse and worked a lot on this and now it's done.

All of the expos outside of the main have wandering considered. There aren't too many expos, and they all have few minerals. The main is hard to harass since the formation is far from the edge, but the nat and mineral onlys are easily harassable. The middle is avoidable if you don't want to use it, but you can for flanking or avoiding.

The cliff sorta makes a contain easy, but you could cliff the contain from ur main and the nat cliff. Once you leave the nat you have three ways to go.

edit: lol oh yeah the ramps for the south are really fucked looking. But, they work perfectly, I've tested with all races (vs comps :( I haven't been able to play sc). I know they look fucked, but playability comes before beauty, and there isn't a way to make inverted ramps with those ramps, and my dirt ramps in transposition didn't come out well, so I tried this instead. The ramps are wallable with 2 depots and a rax. The map looks a lot better in game than in the pic decoration wise
modified by Nightmarjoo
spinesheath
Feels pretty tight, a litte terran advantageous. But there are enough alternative routes and flanking possibilities imo.
I'd remove those ice-holes in the middle, though, and replace them with some doodads, to open it up a little.

The expansions @ 12/6 are very different, the top one is more exposed to ground attacks, the bottom one is tankable...

I'll try to make you some nice looking ramps (dirt probably). If I succeed, you'll hear from me :p
Nightmarjoo
yeah I was wondering about the ice in the middle. I was also considering replacing them with like a town of neutral buildings. That way if the players wanted it less tight they could kill them.

gl with the ramps ;) but mine aren't that bad, they work ^_^

I don't care much for dirt ramps, cuz they're buildable-on and I would then have to make the north ones dirt to balance that, but northern dirt ramps are hard cuz the cliff is apparent, that's why I did it this way, I did dirt in transposition and no one liked those heh.
modified by Nightmarjoo
spinesheath
Well, I'll start now - maybe I can even find enough unbuildable dirt tiles ;)

Ugh, my first close look at your ramps - since the looks was gone anyways, you really could have payed more attention to walkability - You could drop zerglings everywhere ;)
modified by spinesheath
Nightmarjoo
what do you mean?
NastyMarine
Terran map :/

get rid of those ramps :/

12 and 6 are too tight and easy for a T to push to horizontal positions.. matter of fact all positions; just too tight.

all the expos (including nats) mineral placements are hideous :(

ur decoration is fine tho :D

what is pathing for horizontal movement?
modified by NastyMarine
spinesheath
Ok, I created 2 inverted ice ramps. They are in the map (0)Ice Ramps(n). You'd never guess so, huh?^^

If you want my implementation of these, just send me a PM with your Email.
I am not sure if I will create the two non-inverted versions of this type of ramp, though. But since the attributes (size, length, buildability, pathfinding) are almost the same, I don't think they are needed anyways.

Now to the other aspects of the map:
I agree with Nasty, especially after having a close look at it, I think it's too tight.
I'll put some GMCs. Of course you have to mirror them to the other sides :p

I'd like to point out those areas half the way to your opponent. These are important battlezones. You break pushes there, you build up flanks from there. This is the place where a zerg will charge into a protoss army, and in tvt there zones will be the places where both players put their encampments around. Holding these zones probably is game-deciding in tvt.
It's really great how these battlefields are so impostant on this map, but they should be a little larger ;)
modified by spinesheath
Nightmarjoo
heh I see. What do you think of my idea of making a neutral building town in the middle? It could be less tight than with the ice, and destructable to become more open.
@nasty the mineral formations work, they might be ugly, but there is little wandering at all. There is plenty of room to throw a depot or pylon there, and there is room to put a turret or cannon there for defense.
I can take out the trees in NSWE, I just thought they looked nice, that will open the area a little bit. The mineral onlys I guess I can open up, but when I played some games there didn't seem to be any path finding issues or any problems from a lack of space.

in my games the ice paths were never used, except to send a worker to the central expo. Units automatically don't use the ice, they take the path straight to the nat.

hmm you say it's a terran favouring map. I don't think so. The nat is easily tankable yes and some areas do need to be opened up, but there are plenty of alterative routes to take to avoid terran and to flank terran with. At the same time there are tighter places so terran does not get flanked the moment they leave their base. The middle I wanted not entirely open for that reason. The paths straight to the nats are pushable, but a player could just as easily take the ice path which is not pushable-on. Also there is little gas in the map, only two neutral bases with gas, and you cannot push the path there for defense, and ice ramps are fairly large.

As is the middle is fairly open imo.

Hopefully I can get back the internet on my computer so I can test this map more effectively. Comps only show so much.
spinesheath
This map has normal gas. Nostalgia has little gas, R-Point has much gas ;)

Terran will never enter the middle (unless it's Oov with 200/200 ;) ), there is no need to. The middle is mainly a place where you can attack the side paths from.

And actually I don't think you need anything in the middle. So just keep it low, whatever you put there.
Nightmarjoo
ok, open middle it is then :)

I did more testing and the E/W expos definitely need more room. I could move the expos to the other side, but I like them being where they are now, it makes them easily harassable from the middle, thus giving some use to the middle.
Nightmarjoo
edit: well I didn't work on this edit til today so I forgot a lot of what I had wanted to change but whatever. Firstly I edited the latin grammar in the description :) it was slightly off. I think it is good now ^^

12/6 expos are gone. I couldn't think of a way to make them fair, one would always be much more tankable, = bad positional imbalance. mineral only paths are larger. Trees are fewer in 12/6 and gone E/W

the middle is fucking open. I'm still considering adding neutral buildings there, I liked that idea, but I'll play it from ear til then. The decoration looked better with ice in the middle :(

this is 1.3 for me, 1.1 and 1.2 have different changes, I didn't upload those at all.

Comments/Suggestions please :D
5pool
lower mains are smaller, and i'd use 12/6 emptyness to move minonlys a bit, and create center exp

more central highground would be niec too
Nightmarjoo
what do you guys think about the ice being so open and boring? I guess it makes a good alternative route.
Also I left the ramps the way they were; Spine I'm interested in using your ramps, do I have to put them in tile by tile?
Nightmarjoo
oh noes central high ground
that would make the middle much less open, and everyone seemed to want an open middle :O

really lower mains smaller?
I hate center expos ><
5pool
Free Image Hosting at www.ImageShack.us

very ugly done, but u get the idea :) for the 6 / 12 emptyness
Nightmarjoo
lol thats like terran pwnage
Nightmarjoo
ok i uploaded a bad rep;

he thinks mains should be bigger, which I can do since the ice expos are gone; I'll do that sometime soon.
lnept
maybe make ice smaller at top and bottom, make ice smaller at sides, then stretch middle upward and downward, the put expos in the center corners instead of to the the outside. Then you will have good sized paths for the sides and it will be a map where middle is important with ways to flank around terran if they camp it.
Nightmarjoo
hmm definitely some good ideas there, I will work on another update soon.
NastyMarine
put a second ramp near each ramp on each side.. also the vertical main to main movement is too tight.

all around, u've done better
Nightmarjoo
Update: northern/southern ice expos are back, as islands, so they are the same differences from the snow (tanks).
Mains are bigger.

Um that's mostly it.

Replays added, some are from this version others from older versions.
Nightmarjoo
spam to the top of the list
comments/suggestions please
Nightmarjoo
wtf more spam. I don't even have one fucking comment after this update.
Nightmarjoo
WTF
Nightmarjoo
MUSE
Nightmarjoo
MUSE
Nightmarjoo
MUSE
Nightmarjoo
MUSE
Nightmarjoo
great thanks to spinesheath for personally adding his amazing inverted snow ramps.

And I've made this final version because there have been no comments after the update, even after my spam, so I will assume the map is perfect.
NastyMarine
those inverts look so much better now.. good work spinesheath.

that boosts this map by alot :P

but the map isnt that special .. just make a new map :)
PsychoTEMPlar
Can't you build on those snow ramps?
Nightmarjoo
You can but there is't enough room on them to build any building.
spinesheath
You can't build anything on those ramps; you could build a 1x1 building, but since the smallest building is 2x2, you can't place anything.
It may look a little weird ingame though, if there are little buildable spots but not enough to fit a pylon ;)
flothefreak
Free Image Hosting at www.ImageShack.us


ling- and zealotsafe on both bottom positions. which means a safe and early wallin (top needs rax/depot/depot). furthermore, it threatens zerg FE in ZvT. terran can rush and just block the ramp so easily to kill the expansion, force Z to cancel it and/or buy enough time for a bunker.
Replays


--Nightmarjoo[BA] vs Matt[BA](1on1, 1.14p)
--Nightmarjoo[BA] vs Matt[BA](1on1, 1.14p)
--Nightmarjoo[BA] vs psychotemplar(1on1, 1.14p)
--Nightmarjoo[BA] vs psychotemplar(1on1, 1.14p)
--Nightmarjoo[BA] vs psychotemplar(1on1, 1.14p)
--Nightmarjoo[BA] vs lnept(1on1, 1.14p)
--Nightmarjoo[BA] vs l[w]l-Nasty(1on1, 1.14p)

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