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Last update for (8)Red Clover : 2010, 06, 18 04:34
mapIDMapname (comments)map sizeAuthorRatingTypeplay type
3562 (8)Red Clover otherExcalibur1.1betaground

The map has been rated 50 times and got a total of 56 points

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Comments:   GMCS (0 elements)

Two of two new 8p maps from me. 256x256.
these games will take a long time i think
That's the point. These were made for MM's mod night.
Is this for a 2v2v2v2? Kinda hard for someone with a Terran on the other side of the base otherwise. Doesn't look as epic as your other new map but looks decent.
why didn't you list the map size in the map?
Again, "Two of two new 8p maps from me. 256x256.". You are seriously fucking retarded. BWMN does not allow map sizes larger than 128x128 in the map size information you idiot.
Btw, sc2gg ffa was on gamespot video. On this map.

best 8 player map ever
Wow this actually is pretty cool!
No guys, this isn't even close to as good as some other maps we have on the site. It's good but theres many that are better.

(7)Seven Sins
(6)Mark of the Beast

Those are a few good maps for team/FFA play, check them out then honestly tell me this map is better :3
I think we're aware of our good large player maps. And for reference Kino, these maps were never intended for anything other than Mod Night play, and Mod Night does not work like normal SC. You can check out all of my larger maps here:
Well, pretty much all of sc2gg FFAs take place on Seven Sins. Probably over 20 in total. We tried EPICA the other day, just too big. I should've won but dropped before I could do anything. Mark of the Beast looks nice but 6 players ain't the best for our FFAs. Silver star is too generic and portal looks nice, probably going to try it later.
I like the aesthetics of the back-to-back mains.

I also like the center top/bottom expos with the min only. I think you should mimic these for the left/right expos. I don't like that extra pair of expos on left/right.

I don't like the difference between horizontal and vertical distances.

I like the X pathing in the middle, that's something you can't easily do in 128x128 maps for size constraints.

I don't think I like the 3 9 6 12 double bases, but I don't have any suggestions for changing them. I think double expos like that only work with rotational symmetry, so that the distance between the two ramps is much larger, while the distance by air between the mineral formations is close. I don't think rotational symmetry is possible in this map though.

Poor symmetry between the pair of mains is the map's biggest problem imo. For example green (bottom left)'s obvious 3rd is the gas expo at 6, but it's too close to white (bottom right)'s obvious expo at 6. They're so close that they can't fight over the expos. One player wins the conflict and obtains both expos, and the other is out of luck, and the game probably.
On the contrary, orange (bottom left)'s 3rd could be the gas expo at 9, his min only, or the pathed gas expo of the center left expo. The distance from oj's nat to these bases is pretty similar for all three locations, which is what makes that uncertainty possible. Also, the gas expos at 9 are fight-over-able both because of the ramp angle and the sheer distance between the two nearest players to those expos.

The asymmetry is also responsible for the longer vertical distances and fatter area available in horizontal pathing. The former is probably too long, the latter has some poor spacial allocations going on. The former is thus too tight as well. Although, removing the 2nd pair of expos from left/right center will help that point.

There are just so many expos that they dominate the space. I feel there isn't enough room left to the paths, except at 12/6 which is too spacious. This hurts how the battles are going to happen. For example, white vs green is going to end with one winning and one losing early on, and the winner will have claim to a 4th of the map, 11 bases. This situation won't happen the same way between red and orange. Their conflict is drawn more towards the middle thanks to the distances between them and between the expos in their 4th of the map. Then, consider a fight between green and orange. They basically have no where to fight, given relatively short and linear distances, and the small space along that path thanks to the expos.

So I think you need to work on pathing and space management a little. I feel like these differences hurt the map's gameplay, and aren't just "positional variety".

Oh shit I just realized how old this map is ._. I just noticed the map, and liked aspects of it. Maybe you can make use of these comments?
Honestly Marjoo, I don't really map anymore. I thank you for the comments but I doubt I'm going to touch this or most of my other work again. Then again I could fire up SCMDraft tomorrow and make some new large melee maps. You never really know.
Believe it or not I really love this map :)
I think it cool become a 8.5 out of 10 map with the right edits.
The mains, nats and min only's ROCK!!

The middle is terrible tough lol

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