|First i want to say that this is my first space map :)|
And now about the map. I try to make 2 faces with 2 battle centers, and the only thing that i am worried is just if it's balance as it is now. The mains and air expands and center netural expands are mirrored. The other part of the map is random. Terran can't wall (at least i know that he can't wall with one rax, but he might wall with supply, i don't know). Because every player will have 6 expands, i make them all with 6 mineral blocks, except for the center naturals, wich are with 8 blocks.
|P.S. I don't know what was wrong with me, but i really want it to use all types of terrain here :)|
|click here :)|
Well at least only the main base concept is the same. Or mayby the whole map... Anyway the maps are diffrent YO :D
And damn, i should see this map before. It was going to help me for a thing that i was wondering. Well nevermind...
Any comments? :)
|well, I guess everyone has sooner or later the idea of this mainbase-setup.|
dunno if this works for all, but I though of this a long while ago but never transformed it in a map
|This will be my present to bwmn for X-mass. And that means only one thing...|
THAT YOU ARE ALL GOOD BOYS AND GIRLS WHOLE YEAR :D
|YIPPY I'M A GOOD GIRL|
|Can i get a comment at least if there is imbalanced things to fix, and then, if the person who comment the map, have some time to say if he have some suggestions to make it better. I know it's X-mass time, but i see flothefreak, Starpary, Panschk and other mappers to browse around...|
|the biggest rpoblem will be, that zerg can secure with FE his two ramps on bottom- but on top, he cannot|
maybe push the expo on bottom more to the edge (and move teh edge a bit towards mapcenter), so zerg fe would be as far from ramps as on top
and again, I would erase the top right and bottom left lowground expo. you know, I don't like expansions so far away from combat zone. too demanding hidden expos, which _can_ help you win, but usually it's not because of skill then
designwise, the map really rocks btw. it has a cool style where you find everytime something new when walking across the map. great job here
the overall expansion layout looks a bit weird to me, but this is only personal impression. go ahead and make some games on that map to see how this layout works-and if you can make games more interesting by chaning it on one or two spots
the two gasexpos on the left and right side of the center: close the path between the outer minerals and the platform edge! REALLY! units will be fucked up like on LT 12-3 positions, that sucks.
I speak of the top and the bottom mineral block of the mineral line. if there is a space between it and the platform edge, AI-confusing will occur. make it with doodads or terrain(space)
think of mineral block on island near mainbase.
terran can quite easy wall, and after that quite easy defend natural (two ramps, but hey, it's RAMPS, so tanks own). and 3rd expo on island is then even more easy-float CC, make some turrets, and voilą, 3base-3gas-terran :[
|About the min block, i was thinking about it, and i will put it.|
About the center expos, patchfinding, you see thats why i make the terrain, and doodad there, so the patchfinding is good. There is no problem in game.
I will think about fixing the bottom expand as you suggest.
Now see the repley ZvP it's very nice, and it might help you to see more things.
1) Make min blocks on air expands.
2) I move bottom expand with one "spot" upper.
|The min blocks got 0 value.|
|watched those two first replays btw- as it is now, the corner minonlies are not too far away from combat zone in this current version, I take that back. but I think the distance from FE-hatch to the ramps is not yet balance on bottom and top. use dummy-hatcheries in the editor to see by the creep the distance to the ramps. from the eye, it looks as bottom had an easier time to defend|
looks very cool btw, the mainbase concept is hard to integrate into a map, but you built a great map around it, very well done. I like this kinda most of your maps by now.
|Ok i move the bottom exp, with one more "spot" again. Now the diffrence between both is VERY SMALL. And i really have to keep it that way, because i will destroy other distances wich are more important. Really this time check with hatchs to see that there is just 0.5 sm diffrence in the creep spreding. I really don't think that this is something bad, or will effect the gameplay.|
|don't like this map|
don't want to play on it -.-
|°Lose the platfroms in the rusted pit. its bad enough that if they drop crap back there that u have to run around to kill it but navigating the pit makes it annoying.|
°solar array when not clumped looks ugly. imo those little X's all over looks crappy. You can squish them down to a line and just circle the rusty pit holes to acheive the same effect of unbuildableness.
|also the natural expos are pretty imbalanced looking. the bottom one is much larger. I don't know how you could fix that either T_T|
|Mayby you should look at the jpg again.|
|I like this map a lot. One of my favorites :)|
And that's everything I can say for now, don't see anything to fix atm.
|hmm, I think this style is cool and original, but it could be pulled off better...|
|MAKE REDS NAT BIGGER AND IT HAS MOTW EZ!!!!!!!!!! It has to be bigger.. the area around red's mineral line at the nat is so small... its too EZily harassed!!!!|
|I will work on it this night.|
Reds nat is more open now.
|much better, this was the biggest flaw|
still seems very tight to me
|yes indeed. try to open it up on the right nd left most sides of red's nat by adding another box/square of high platform|
|Everytime when i try to do the red nat more wider is getting so much space on the low platform. It's also blocking other ways, and it's making the distance shorter. You have to understand that for one square i am making other disbalances. If you look at on the other side of view on red nats, you will see that the space is the same on both sides, but because of the ramps position there is space to build around the ramps. It's a little hard for me to explain, but if someone want to try to download the map and try to edit it - be welcome. After edit check if distance and other staff is right.|
The only thing that i think i can do without making any big changes is to make blues nat more tight.
|"The only thing that i think i can do without making any big changes is to make blues nat more tight."|
then so be it. i think thats the best thing u can do. Jus make sure theres enuff room for a barracks or cannons etc.. i understand what ur saying.. ur doin a good job wit what u have layed down before u.
but i think that the best thing u can do is make blues nat tighter
|Done - I guess this is ok.|
|or just put some unbuildable doodads? like this cable-cross or the "splattered hole"|
|eh, i still dislike the naturals.|
whatever, cool style.
|Is there a super hero to fix the nats, because i don't know what to fix really... I will give credit!|
|it's not imbalance to fix. it just doesn't feel good somehow. with more "normal nats" or just another setup (mb same execution but on lowground), I'd love the map. actually you could try this. just make the highground bases and natural to normal platform, with keeping the "highground edges" as small walls. instead of ramps, you can just make a hole in the wall. if you don't get what i mean, lemme know i gonna show you|
|Yeah, i understand what u mean, i will post a picture of your version, and see how it will be, but somehow the highground is a little more spacial about this map... Dunno what :)|
but don't make the main entrance 1rax-wallable. make it to require 1depot1rax. but think of PvZ early -> don't make it too wide.
try some setups with unbuildable doodads/terrain and low-value(24)-minblockades
|Update it, as flothefreak suggest. I hope you like it :)|
modified by LGI
|im sorry but i think the whole map is ruined now.. (imo) dont like it now|
|Highground looked better somehow. i like the pos of the min onlies|
|OMG, WHAT SHOULD I DO REALLY?!|
I am going to shoot myself if i don't get a tip what to do with the nats. I will upload another version with the highground look, and i will try to make the nats look better, if it doesn't work for you, and i don't get a tip how to fix it, i will shoot myself, and i will be around your souls and making creppy shits for the rest of your lifes!
|Version LGI & flothefreak:|
Version LGI & a bullet in his brain:
NOTE: I put hatcherys on the pics, to see where the creep goes, and how easy for each player is to defend the nat.
AND THE BIG NOTE: On both pictures some of the creep is cut i don't know why. Only on version LGI and Flo the top nat the creep is not cut. If you try to put the hatcherys to see where the creep goes, it goes right to the choke.
|i like the normal platform version a lot more (still, you can make the natural area look better, i know you can :) )|
you don't have to gimme credit actually, i didn't really do much about the map
|You mean that you like the low platform more? Well i can play a little more with the nats, it's ok, but my real problem is that guy-X and guy-Z says that they like low platform, and guy-Y and guy-W says that they like more the high ground platform. But guy-LGI loves you all, so he can't diside what to keep!|
|if you can decide by other's opinions, make your decisive. no one will have problems with that.|
|Btw i think i will give you credits for older maps, that you really help a lot, but i was not that greatfull to give you credit i guess... *shame*|
|blabla not necessary at all|
that's what we're here for. that's my point of view at least :p
|but my real problem is that guy-X and guy-Z says that they like low platform, and guy-Y and guy-W says that they like more the high ground platform. But guy-LGI loves you all, so he can't diside what to keep!|
made my day
ok, how about taking the low gorud version flo had in mind. then, take away some of the walls to the left and the right wich make the naturals so tight, why? Noone will ever attack from both sides (only if his army is large enough. THat way, you have an easy entrance and exit of the natural and can build some Gates there and stuff.
|Nice map and nice to see some dark psytrancer head in the sc scene!|
|At last! I am not alone!|
|Looks nice. Choke will be pretty hard to defend though, TvP will be pretty hard in early game.|
|Two things make me to worry.|
First is about TvZ. The lower ground version seems to be quite vulnerable to 3 barracks upgraded marine-medic push(so called 'Flaming marines' in Korean term.) Even though zerg knows that T is going 3barracks it seems to be very hard to construct sunken colonies in proper position. Since this is not 3 hatch forcing map and has quite long distance, Z has chance to make lurkers before T starts attack, but then it would make Z to play 2 hatch tech play, which is quite vulnerable to T these days, anyway.
Second is about TvP. Well it would be your style but I don't think P would like much doodads on the battle field. It blocks units movement(especially those stupid dragoons) and that would be disadvantageous to P.
|well these are very "special" scenarios, and even pros wont see the map and go 3rax-rines over and over again|
|Lol, dang LGI, I guess the comment on Atma really got you motivated to put obs ver on your maps ^_^.|
|There was a little mistake in all my latest obs versions. Now i fix it (i think).|