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2nd BWMN Map Pack

deadline to enter maps: 2013, 04, 07 (Year, month, day)
For the 2nd.
Discussions of possible maps should be done here.

I removed all and i am re titling the new maps as was done with the first Maps with the [BWMN].
Format for maps will now be!!

(#)[BWMN]____ {Version here if used in last tournament}(n)

NameAuthorDownloadvote(1., 2., 3. choice)
(2)Cross GCrystalDrag;FreaklingMelee Obs Picture5
(4)[BWMN]Feel My LJungleterrain; editors: Freakling, CrystMelee Obs Picture5
(3)[BWMN]Demonio ALastCurse; editor: FreaklingMelee Obs Picture7
(4)[BWMN]GemlJungleTerrain; Freakling,CrystalDragMelee Obs Picture4
(4)[BWMN]Saryesik AtyCrystalDrag; FreaklingMelee Obs Picture10
(2)[BWMN]OxFreaklingMelee Obs Picture5
The competition is closed!
Comments:

traceurling
EDIT:

Final to-do-list

Complete - Cross Game
- Observer Version
- Training Version

Complete - Oxide
- Observer Version
- Training Version

Complete - Demonio Azul
- Observer Version
- Training Version

Complete - Gemlong
- Observer Version (Freakling)
- Training Version (Freakling)

Complete - Saryesik Atyrau
- Observer Version
- Training Version

Feel My Love
- finish terrainwork (Freakling)
- drop spots (done by CrystalDrag)
- complete resource debugging (done by Freakling)
- better map name? - No point now published in iCCup



General Tasks
- Observer and training versions (done by Freakling)
- Map pack compilation (Freakling)
- Measure scout/rush distances/timings for all maps (nat choke to nat choke would probably be best)(traceurling)
- TL publishing post(Freakling %>0)
- Artwork suggestios
- Wall In Pics
- Gas gathering rates(done by CrystalDrag)
- LP entries for the maps (traceurling, Ill do this when the maps are finalized)

Tell Freakling or CrystalDrag if you want to help out, one of us will put your name on the list, so every one knows what is already been taken care of.
If you have further ideas, tell usand we will add them to the list
modified by traceurling
Freakling
Terz is probable... But so are a gazillion other maps Crystal has fabricated over the last few weeks...
traceurling
And will we be including some of the maps from the first mappack depending on BWMN Open results?
CrystalDrag
I havent made a gazillion. >:)
I think just Gemlong will be included into this one?
Freakling
Actually, judging from the map poll, Cross Game, Resonance and Melting Pot are the popular maps...
I think I'll make a final feedback thread when the final cast is over...
CrystalDrag
Oh just saw the poll. :)
But i would like new maps...
traceurling
We should still retain perhaps most popular map and most balanced map? We should keep some old maps so when we have another tourney people still have some familiarity...
CrystalDrag
also', i would prefer if my less-standard maps was used... TERU i really want to go through (three months!!!)
...and this map pack also needs (in my opinion)
symmetry used in ChemLab, My desert one, or shizi...
two (?) standard maps, such as feel my love (really like this one!) and maybe one of freaklings... but should have a teo player map
two 3 player map (demonio) and something else
CrystalDrag
this one needs more diverity of mappers!!
traceurling
Hopefully I'll make a good map before then
Freakling
I feel like the BWMN Open has brought in a big pile of very good new maps, so we won\'t run short on maps any time soon, but I think it is generally a bad idea to drown players in too many maps, just because we can easily make a map pack every month right now does not mean that players would want to practice that many maps or they would be considered more likely by other tournaments or ICCup, rather the contrary.
So I want to focus our efforts on a few maps and make them as perfect as possible, rather than just mass publish.
And for the maps not picked immediately I am optimistic that there will always be a next map pack :D

So I was planning on keeping two maps, and adding four more. I think it will be nice for players if their efforts that went into practicing and helping me inprove those maps, to see that it can also pay off for them.

Cross Game and either Gemlong or Melting Pot are the most likely candidates right now, I suppose, or Maybe even Resonance... I will try to get some real final feedback on TL, when the finals are over.
The rest of the maps will obviously have to complement that base stock.

I started with demonio, because Hazard is very likely out, and it is the best candidade for the three player map slot right now.
As a new two player map I was considering either Oxide or Blood & Iron. But maybe Crystal has a breakthrough with on of his...
I also really would like to see Feel my Love finished. The whole standard macro map + islands concept has exactly the right balance between comfortably standard and novel to make it interesting.
Between ShÝzý, ChemLab and Crystal's Desert map I honestly think the last one is the best choice, and it will fit in with pretty much anything else we may add, so I will include it, too.

Maybe Tenebra or Blackjack are options, but with an ash map almost surely carrying over, I don't want to add another one right now, it's time for other tilesets to shine ;P
modified by Freakling
Freakling
Actually, Crystal, would you be very mad if we took your Desert map and not TERU, if we keep Gemlong and Cross Game, and added a finished Feel my love instead? So we would end up with:

(2)Cross Game
(2)Oxide
(3)Demonio Azul
(4)Gemlong
(4)Feel My Love
(4)Saryesik Atyrau

That would equal out on so many levels:
- 6 different tilesets
- 2 maps with even ground mains and nats, 3 with standard rampes mains, 1 with inverse ramp
- lots of different symmetries and playstyles
- mostly equal distribution between authors.
asiantraceur
I agree with keeping 2 old maps (at least)...Cross Game seems like a good choice...so does Gemlong...I don't really like the double bridges of Melting Pot :O because in Destination you at least had a backdoor but here its like fml...

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0AsQCUFYgnekddGFFdHVwb3hjMW5OSlpkOHZTYjhpS2c#gid=0

For anyone who's interested those are the map stats, looks a bit imba but prolly cuz of skill difference and not enough games played on it...
modified by asiantraceur
CrystalDrag
I would not be very mad. :)
The tilesets are nice :)

no Ice (T_T) I am too lazy to work on my conversion but oh well..

And Oxide better than frostmourne, because it doesn't have as much "un-standardness"

And does "CrystalDrag and Freakling" have to be there in CrossGame?... all the maps would have "_______ and Freakling" as their author.

I guess i will start working on the Desert one Again.
And i really need to learn to pronounce it
modified by CrystalDrag
traceurling
We definitely more map testing on these maps than last time
CrystalDrag
I am willing to test.. the prblem is my iccup launcher does not add the option to the list...
traceurling
Well first of all one problem was weird paying when mining minerals, testing that can be done single player...
CrystalDrag
that is easy enough to do... but testing rushes also... etc etc...
im going to do some editting on the desert before the testing... so is this going to be the final maps?

And then we has to find a way for community to use this one... hopefull iccup kept an eye out on the tournament (they included it as a news on there site...) and hopefull might use some of the map from thAt the voting shows favorable.
CrystalDrag
actually i thinknmy desert one js the only one that needs testin for the minerals, seeing as freakling usually fixes his (except on oxide's natural!) and the other two are fixed, And feel my love is still being worked on.
CrystalDrag
Presenting the Freakling CrystalDrag and Jungleterrain map pack!!!!!!!!
Freakling
This may be final, or not... It's work in progress...
traceurling
Hey freakling, can I make a writeup on iCCup forums about the first BWMN Mappack, or did you want to do that? Don't want to ninja you...
JungleTerrain
I'd like to see more diversity in mapmakers :)

Also, what Freakling said,

"Perfect a small amount of maps, instead of mass publish"

I think this is a very good way to go about it. Let's not flood the mapping scene with too many maps.

=======================================

I think we also have to take in mind the future of BROODWARMAPS.NET and what the effects of the BWMN Mappacks and BWMN tournaments are on the foreign BW community (players and mapmakers).

These are things I want to see happen for BWMN in the near future:

-The foreign scene to really respect BWMN's mapping efforts.

-BWMN to be known for their high quality of mapmaking (which means we have to put in a lot for each map, which we are already doing to a good degree, I think).

-An increase of activity in BWMN (more mapmakers + more maps per mapmaker).

-Any new mapper to the site can feel that their mapping skills are improving because of positive AND substantial amount of feedback on map threads.

-Any new or inveterate mapper can feel like they can contribute to the BWMN Mappacks (less of this CrystalDrag/Freakling/Jungleterrain Mappacks).

-More events for BWMN (like restarting MOTM, more mapping competitions, BWMN tours, mappacks). This we are working on, but we would need an increase in activity + devoted people to do some of this.

=======================================

I think we should note how many maps the Korean Professional mapping scene used to introduce and try to match the frequency of maps produced.

We should probably limit the number of Mappacks to some number (2-4) a year (assuming each mappack contains 6 maps).

Just some thoughts.
modified by JungleTerrain
traceurling
I agree with your analysis Jungle...it'll be hard though...best way would be someway to get maps onto iCCup I guess... Also I'm assuming these few map packs would retain popular old maps? Also what we need is for tournament organizers to respect us so that maybe when they make a tournament, instead of using old maps they'll come here for recommendations or commission a map...maybe sometime we should have a map making competition and put it on teamliquid, and make it so regular map makers (basically us) aren't allowed to participate and then we judge which map takes first etc. and have a small money prize pool?
JungleTerrain
I think we could do that, too.

Having a mapmaking competition for people who are not BWMN regulars (which they will eventually become :) this is my master plan), and the winner gets to be put in the BWMN mappack or something... Idk.

Would be cool, though. Pretty excited for the current spike in interest of BW with TLS and other events.
CrystalDrag
I think i could restart the MOTW if freakling is too busy...
-Any new or inveterate mapper can feel like they can contribute to the BWMN Mappacks (less of this CrystalDrag/Freakling/Jungleterrain Mappacks).(!!!!)

The rate that the tournament went (2 months) is a good pace... I suppose we could spend a month perfecting maps between each tournament, and then use another 2 months to host another tournament and polish more maps.

finding more map makers is harder though
modified by CrystalDrag
Freakling
@traceur: I already started my final writeup/opinion fishing thread... But it's not finished yet.

Also, I just need to quote and comment on parts of jungle's post:

"-BWMN to be known for their high quality of mapmaking (which means we have to put in a lot for each map, which we are already doing to a good degree, I think).

-An increase of activity in BWMN (more mapmakers + more maps per mapmaker)."

I think the tourney already brought a lot of mappers back :D

"-Any new mapper to the site can feel that their mapping skills are improving because of positive AND substantial amount of feedback on map threads."

Don't we already do this?

"-Any new or inveterate mapper can feel like they can contribute to the BWMN Mappacks (less of this CrystalDrag/Freakling/Jungleterrain Mappacks)."

Maybe making some new community map, like Melting Pot, can help inexperienced mappers to gain experience and recognition, or help motivate self-declared "lazy people" to contribute their share.

"-More events for BWMN (like restarting MOTM, more mapping competitions, BWMN tours, mappacks). This we are working on, but we would need an increase in activity + devoted people to do some of this."

What I would really like to see is more people to do basic testing/debugging. Resources and wallins should just work, when a map is published. But it's a lot of work for one person.
But as I said I\'ll write a guide on that matter soon.

"I think we should note how many maps the Korean Professional mapping scene used to introduce and try to match the frequency of maps produced.

We should probably limit the number of Mappacks to some number (2-4) a year (assuming each mappack contains 6 maps)."

Just do the math... We releasd the last map pack, when? In early October (official release on TL). Tourney did not start before December an ran for two months. Add another month for preparing a map pack (perfecting six maps is not a small task, even if their respective mapmakers already did all the basic work), and we and up with at most 3 map packs a year, with two maps carrying over from the last pack each time, so that\'s at most 12 maps a year.

@Crystal: I just fear that there will be a lack of people actually voting for maps in a MOTM or similar competition.
What I would like, is more people contributing to the actual discussions regarding maps. For the last maps I created all this nice infrastructure, like the map pack, aspirant and remake threads, but in the end it was me who had to make the decisions and do all the work. I think that has changed a bit though, since the tourney more people, like you, seem to put efforts into this, please keep is that way!
modified by Freakling
traceurling
I agree with all that I'll try to do more an make a new map soon...
crystaldrag
Aw darn... I was going to take a break from mapping to read manga... xP But even if i don't make as many maps, i shall still help with the community.

I think my efforts have been.. to improve the website more... I was thinking i would go through the recommended maps...

Also i am unreliable for scheduled times, as i am only suppose to have 1 hour on computer >_> One bad thing of still young.

Also i am considering cleaning up the articles that are outdated and be written better. Or some that have been proven outright wrong.
modified by CrystalDrag
CrystalDrag
Traceurling, i like December. :)
traceurling
Aw damn does that mean I have to actually finish a map now :P k I guess Ill start with that...
Btw freakling, for your writeup, if you want to reference map stats I updated them to include the finals and the 3rd place match...
modified by traceurling
Freakling
What I would have really liked to see, are reliable stats on map picks and banns, by race, in the playoffs. The actual result statistics are unfortunately not only tilted heavily towards Zerg, because of the player base, but also statistically insignificant throughout, because of the small sample sizes.
CrystalDrag
Freakling, I am going to rewrite the article(s) on the Gas Issue... The previous articles do not cover the different races/different 46 positions that gas can be near the gas... Do you have any info that i could use? I'm putting a couple hours into testing...

There is the old (2)GasIssue Map, with some information, but the proximity of the geysers next to each other might have effected mining rates.
modified by CrystalDrag
Freakling
Actually, I'd advise you to just wait a couple more days. I am working on a whole new approach, to both gas and mineral balancing, that I perfected with TechnicS' help and had great success with.
CrystalDrag
hmm. can i send you what i got then? i spent sn hour yesterday testing mining rates per minute for each race...
and i was going to test them over longer time periods..
CrystalDrag
if you are going to that, i shall improve other articles and recolor the titles in cyan.
Realized there no no guide to make custom ramps, so i shall make an article on that.
modified by CrystalDrag
traceurling
Yes please do
CrystalDrag
Will you make a map with them? :D
traceurling
It'll take a while to make it but I'll try :D
CrystalDrag
Any particular Tileset you want me to start with?
Freakling
You should start by fixing your HTML tags in your latest guide!
traceurling
All the tile sets! Haha it doesn't matter as long as eventually you cover all of them ...
CrystalDrag
what tileset will your next map be?
and i will cover all of rhem
and i fixed my article
traceurling
Working on December War right now but that doesn't have any ramps...next map I'm not sure yet I have some ideas...twilight...ash...jungle...space...but most likely I will be doing twilight...
crystaldrag
Okay then, i shall work on the guild with that tileset :P

Also, There are many ramp collections out there already... Are you sure you need me to create a new guide on how to create new ones??
modified by crystaldrag
traceurling
Oh I don't need need a guide on it, but how to make ramps is something I've always wanted to kno in case I had to fix something or wanted to make a different ramp or just if I wasn't connected to the Internet and cusnt download the ramps...
crystaldrag
Ah Sure then~
I can send you a picture and some annotations, and that will be fine?

I am compiling a "ramp pack" of my own creations... Some ramps has tiles that do not correspond with their tile levels and such... If you wait for that, youll have all seven tilesets :D
modified by crystaldrag
traceurling
That'd be awesome :D
JungleTerrain
I have to say, I'm working on Feel My Love (the acronym is FML haha), and it's not easy...

I have the ramps, been rotating things, made the islands construct, yada yada yada...

But I have no mouse, so it's taking a long time :(
Freakling
No mouse O_o.
You know, how you can safe a lot of time?: Spend some of it buying one!
crystaldrag
fml haha
:-)
I don't know how anyone can map without mouse... The mac user with 50 max apm?
I have two backup mouses

@traceurling, I have 6 of the ramps, I use the Ash ramps from last curse, so all ramps are out there. :)
modified by CrystalDrag
JungleTerrain
i dont want to waste money on mouse...

We had 2 mouses here at my apartment last semester of school, but idk what my roommates did with them.
CrystalDrag
there is no such thing as "wasting money on a mouse". Benefits far outweighs the cost!!
JungleTerrain
well, in this case it would be a waste because we already have 2 mouses, I just don't know what my roommates did with them (they don't know either).

and it doesn't help me in school -_-
Freakling
You should just confiscate your roomates' mice, until they remember...
modified by Freakling
CrystalDrag
yes :) steal mouse from them. faster than going to the store!
if there was more cooperative maps such as Voidrim and Grains of Sand, there can be more mappers in the mappack!
traceurling
We could do another community map xD or we could do 4 people do 4 corners of a map for the Fantasy competition...
traceurling
Oh also we could always be like, post a thread with 10-15 maps and have people vote for which ones they want in the Mappack :)
Taranok
link in the main post is broken.
Freakling
Should we replace Cross Game by Resonance, now that it is ICCup map?
Or is 3 Jungleterrain maps in the pack too much?
modified by Freakling
CrystalDrag
3 is a big number...
JungleTerrain
yeah, even 2 is pushing it... keep cross game
CrystalDrag
CrystalDrag : 1.5
Freakling : 2.5
Jungle Terrain : 2
Freakling
I am maximally at 2! You forgot "unknown smurf: 0.5".

Any progress on Feel My Love?!
modified by Freakling
traceurling
Is there anything I can do to help with these maps? Idk testing pathing or something?
CrystalDrag
You call me an unknown smurf? D:
You can create better maps to replace them! ^^
Freakling
Was I talking about you without knowing it, or are you just thinking I was talking about you? What am I missing here?
JungleTerrain
Im working on FML (lol nice acronym)

its just taking a while cuz of lack of mouse...

I think some parts of the map (mostly the nats) will turn out a little awkward, as a result of this technological impairment :O
modified by JungleTerrain
Freakling
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/FML... Hmm... Which one is so nice?

Just get a mouse, damn it! Can't be so darn hard... Steal one, if you must, the end justifies the means!
CrystalDrag
^

"Was I talking about you without knowing it"
modified by CrystalDrag
Freakling
I need proof!
CrystalDrag
Should i upload my sketches?
Freakling
Whatever...
traceurling
Hey, for this Map Pack, do you think we should put like 10-ish maps in, and then have a pre release thing so that the community can give feed back on which ones they like and dont like, and then veto 4 maps for the tournament? Then we can guarentee the maps are somewhat liked...
CrystalDrag
Very interesting idea... Me gusta.
Freakling
That's even more maps to finish and debug...

But for the future, a format with 2 carry-overs, 2 community choices and 2 picks to comlement the rest for a well rounded map pack seems like a good idea.
traceurling
Well we don't exactly have a due date or anything do we can take as much time as we want...iCCup probably won't make a new map pack for a while
Also on a side note, we definitely do not want to miss the release of map pack 3.0 there's talk that a lot of maps might get replaced in that map pack
Freakling
Let's see, when Jungle is gonna finish his lovechild of a map...

If it isn't soon, we need to restructure anyways...
CrystalDrag
Ahaha...
1 month? :P
4/1/13

We need to occupy at least 50% of that map pack then. So many maps not used! Except FS. Glad to see python and LT mostly dead. But only FS played most of the time. On USEAST anyway.
traceurling
Yah same on iCCup...mainly just Fighting Spirit and Map of the Week being played on iCCup...They probably won't be releasing a new mappack soon..they're updating the current mappack to fix random bugs they've found in stuff like Observer versions and getting the (new) maps up to date...Remember it's only mappack 2.5 right now...that's still quite a ways from 3.0 (gogo, more BWMN Tournaments :D)
Freakling
Post moved to OP
modified by Freakling
traceurling
Do any of the maps have
http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=399957
that as a problem?

How about
"Love Your Enemy"?
"Valentine's Battle"
"Cupid's Conflict"
"Heartbreak Warfare" (and then change the heart into a broken heart)
"All's Fair in Love and War"
"February Fight"(why am I so good with alliterations :D)
"Love Hurts"
"St. Valentine's Crusade"
-throwing out random ideas...lol running out of ideas...or some variation of those names...

I'll work a bit on Cross Game...just I'll pay attention to pathing in game...

Also in regards to mineral bugs, do I just report where the mineral bugs are, or do I just edit the map and upload the change?

I can also write a 2-3 sentence flavor text for each map if you guys want, kinda like how Andromeda(I think) has that short thing that says something along the lines of "Send your enemies to distant Andromeda" or whatever it was...just to add some more life into the maps...

Do we have a projected release date? Or what about a sponsor yet?

I can help with graphics and banners...

Yah basically I can help with stuff that isn't too time consuming cuz of parents D:
modified by traceurling
Freakling
We do it like Blizzard: It's done when it's done :P

My maps should not have weird drop spots, but I'll add that to the list.

For map infos/tl map release thread I already have some drafts, will be awesome if it works out the way I picture it with graphics and stuff...
Maybe you could check some graphic sites (deviantart comes to mind) for awesome space/planet panoramas to use as banners or backgrounds, and ask the creators for permission to use it.
I am going to try and spice it up a bit, and I had the idea to add some "lulz tactics" suggestion for each map.
I already have "All your island are belong to us" (take your opponents iasland as your expo) for Feel my love, "Mass-proxy - in your face" (use the demon's face for proxy) for Demonio... Maybe you have some ideas for the other maps...

About your name suggestions:
"Love Your Enemy"?
Really? Sounds like a dumb tactic :P

"Cupid's Conflict"
lol...

"Heartbreak Warfare" (and then change the heart into a broken heart)
Too much like "Heartbreak Ridge"...

"All's Fair in Love and War"
How about just "Love and War"?

"February Fight"(why am I so good with alliterations :D)
I don't get it...

"Love Hurts"
Nah....

"St. Valentine's Crusade"
"Valentine's Battle"
Only if we publish on Valentine's day... Oh, wait... Nevermind...

Make sure you have the newest version (for Cross Game it's the last one I uploaded) and then just do the fixes yourself, if required. Just tell us when you are done and upload the updated map (if it's not your own, it would probably be sensitive to upload as a new map).
JungleTerrain
Why not (4)Homosexuality?
CrystalDrag
^

I can easily fix the ghost holes.
i just need whatever map...
But probably after the edits to the maps of freakling

"- make sure there are no drop spots (Freakling)
"
I am insulted
modified by CrystalDrag
Freakling
I know that you know how to fix drop spots... I was refering to what you call "ghost spost"

However, don't get all panicky about it:

First and foremost:

The 0.99 iCCup version of Wind and Cloud is like the worst, buggy alpha (seriously, I would not call something like that a beta) version of a map you can imagine!

It really makes me question how after about 10 years of "pro mapping" Rose.of.Dream is not even able to come up with a decent starting point for a map (execution wise, but most of the concepts were lackluster, too), had he posted it here, like 5 people had probably pointed the most obvious issues out to him...

What it comes down to is that what Pucca describes is just your generic everyday tank spot, which the map is full of, because obviously something trivial like that could not be fixed before the map went into playtesting...

Some of those spots are big enough, to drop a real life tank in them, by the way, so complaining about ghosts nuking your nat means you probably got lucky :P

However, just like is is practically impossible to drop a tank in a spot, were it would just barely fit in, it is likewise almost impossible to drop a ghost into any small spot were it would barely fit in.
And, by the way, it is not possible to fix all those ghost spots, ghosts just have a too tiny collision box. Would ne almost like fixing "Zergling holes".

Bottom line: Just every one: Fix your tank spots properly, and there won't be any problems...

(most funny things are "Hydra spots" by the way, a lurker cannot fit in there, but you can morph it there anyway!)
traceurling
Haha yah and the thing is, it only takes like a minute to fix each drop spot right? Just throw in a doodad or do some quick tile editing and it's done...
Freakling
Exactly.
CrystalDrag
Gemlong - change cliffs behind nat formations to make sure there are no drop spots unreachable by ground)

Saryesik Atyrau - complete resource debugging

Will do these two.
Also may fix some ugly tiles on gemlong (bad overlord spot tiles)
Freakling
Can you start with Gemlong, so I can have a look at Saryesik first?

Are you talking about the copy-pasted high ground clutter on Gemlong?
There are also some weird cliff edges, that are in fact bridge edges, for some reason. So if you want to improve on that, go ahead!
CrystalDrag
Yes i planned to start on Gemlong. :D
"Are you talking about the copy-pasted high ground clutter on Gemlong?" Yes!
Yes i will fix alot of it. :)
CrystalDrag
And i cant find the bridge edges.
Freakling
Picture removed...
modified by Freakling
CrystalDrag
(;
CrystalDrag
(;
crystaldrag
nevermind traceurling, you can do the debugging
I know that there is a problem with the 12 expansion. And some of the gas placements need to be changed.
modified by CrystalDrag
Freakling
Latest version of Cross Game is map ID 4580.
Gas positions are fine on that one, but some mineral position still are not (7th in SW main, for example).
CrystalDrag
Are you busy traceurling?... I could do the balancing for the crossgame if you feel like you wont have any time (by the time Jungle finishes his...)...
Freakling
Just do it, it should be relatively minimal work anyway.
CrystalDrag
Yes i will do it.
I love debugging with protoss. :) All you need is the first four probes to drop down all the nexuses.
Freakling
But you need to do the other races as well...
But I think I will put this onto the list of improvements for my guide: Start with protoss, because it is the easiest to build with, then terran and finally Zerg...
modified by Freakling
traceurling
Wasn't sure where to ask this, but can someone link me whichever resource is best for Ice Ramps?
Freakling
(4)Tomorrow should be safe to copy from...
CrystalDrag
I did upload Ice Ramps which were debugged from HIZAKI...
I suppose you debugged the ice ramps from Tomorrow then... Because those korean ramps LastCurse used had bugs in them originally.

http://www.panschk.de/mappage/comments.php?mapid=4535

And you even commented on it...
modified by CrystalDrag
traceurling
Aisshhh can you link me the ramp resources you made for each tileset? I'll just dl them all at once and be done with it...also where do I find the triggers for obs maps so I can copy paste it...
CrystalDrag
http://www.mediafire.com/?94rpgiuu6r7iy3g

Just look at some of freaklings maps. o.O
modified by CrystalDrag
traceurling
Thanks crystal :)
Also would scout timings be just using a probe? I think I can do that, but what time unit should I use? Just have a stopwatch and time it? Or just use chaos launcher's in game timer in fastest? I dunno if ingame time units are different...
Also Freakling if you want I can help with TL post...
modified by traceurling
Freakling
Using a worker (doesn't really matter which particular one), unit would be game seconds of course (the SC inbuild timer), it would probably be the best to use a launcher which displays an ingame timer (like wLauncher).

Also, it would be nice if you could make maps for scounting routes/passable terrain and buildable terrain/wallins, just like I made for the last map pack.

And you could write map entries for liquipedia, to publish together with the maps on TL.

And measuring gas gathering rates for all expos would be nice. Use the timed gas mining test method I described in my guide.
traceurling
Okay well I'll start with scouting timings just using Chaos Launcher...and how do you get the buidable/walk able terrain pics? And is scouting path pic just you watch a worker travel then draw it on the map pic?
Freakling
Use screenshots from scmdraft for the pics. Having a unit/building selected will give you the grey overlays.

Scout paths don't need to be 100% accurate, just the rough route and the ecact timing are interesting, anything more comes down to scout micro anyways.
modified by Freakling
traceurling
I got the unit and building pics for demonio, saryesik, and oxide...I still need to paste them together cuz even in 25% zoom I couldn't get the full map so I screenshotted the top and bottom half just gotta cut and paste now...
traceurling
http://www.mediafire.com/?blh9dfb4lt17qbc
Kind of rough, but got it done...my copy/pasting skills need improvement D:
traceurling
Well I got the scout timings down I think...still need to make a pic..
Freakling
Can you make it that the building map has suggested wallins on it, and the movement map scouting routes, like I did for the last map pack?
traceurling
K...also, how did you make the building and unit maps last time? My pics seem kinda sketchy and I might want to remake them...
Freakling
I think I used different layers, one wit the normal map pick, one with the greyed out areas, and just dimmed the opacity until I liked the contrast.

The scouting routes I just drew as lines (if you use gimp try ctrl and shift keys while drawing lines).
traceurling
Just use pics like this as scouting path
http://i.imgur.com/97xK3sU.png
:)
CrystalDrag
Demonio is cut off
‎(◠‿ ◕
We are very close to finishing :D
traceurling
Should the BWMN Maps' type be changed to "League"?
CrystalDrag
Sure? :D
Freakling
Doesn't exactly matter...
But if you have spare time:
- make the "tactical" map pictures for these maps
- update the "recommended maps" section with these maps (and probably remove all the far-outdated ones...)
CrystalDrag
- update the "recommended maps" section with these maps (and probably remove all the far-outdated ones...)
Done
Just 140 old maps removed... 6 at a time.. not big deal
traceurling
We have a recommended maps area? :o
CrystalDrag
when you go to map database, you can check the box "recommended " and then searh for the maps that have been set as recommended.
traceurling
I like Crash Course
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CrystalDrag voted (4)[BWMN]Saryesik Aty as 1. choice
CrystalDrag voted (3)[BWMN]Demonio A as 2. choice
CrystalDrag voted (2)[BWMN]Ox as 3. choice
Freakling voted (4)[BWMN]Feel My L as 1. choice
Freakling voted (4)[BWMN]Geml as 2. choice
Freakling voted (3)[BWMN]Demonio A as 3. choice
lastcurse voted (4)[BWMN]Saryesik Aty as 1. choice
lastcurse voted (3)[BWMN]Demonio A as 2. choice
lastcurse voted (2)[BWMN]Ox as 3. choice
traceurling voted (2)Cross G as 1. choice
traceurling voted (2)[BWMN]Ox as 2. choice
traceurling voted (4)[BWMN]Geml as 3. choice
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