|what's this? 2039 is the only map i have.|
gaia for 3 players! ;)
|(2)Avalon x10... -.-|
|Hard decision what maps I submit :/|
|btw avalon is extremely annoying map, probably my least favorite of Arden, i remember playing 10+ test games WAY back and it really had way too much cash.|
|Yeah... I actually have to agree with Inept on that one. I love the look of Avalon, but I wasn't really mindful of balance or flow and I was making it. I made that map on my laptop when I was banned from my comp ;). I don't know who submitted it, but I wouldn't recommend it.|
|Reviem FTW!!! lol |
|Idk what my second map choice should be :/|
what do you guys think? :)
|lol I really don't like fortitude, it is quite possibly the most boring map I have ever played.|
|Guys, are air maps allowed? Just asking but I guess I know the answer..."No"|
|why not, gosu airmaps would be always nice :)|
|I wanna see Nazca up there :D|
|woot someone added reviem|
|I think Nazca is a regular map at this point. I'm sure Lex will use it.|
|Thx Nightmarjoo... I love you to.|
|Compared to Galaxy Prime are league maps like Geometry or Nemesis freaks.Envied and despised is Galaxy Prime2.0 still one of the best maps in this mappool.A map with a precise concept,a outstanding execution and beyond any doubts excellent balanced.|
|lol Arden <3 :) I like your other maps =/|
|I don't =D|
|omega > galaxy prime.|
i dont know why JK) kept GalaxyPrime...it has less flair, style, structure and originality (speaking of a certain theme/atmosphere on the whole map) as omega, and is much more crappy :/
|Gefrierbrand is awesome and basic, so it is win.|
IT IS DELICIOUS MAP! YOU MUST PICK!
|Gefrierbrand is a big no-no.|
|@flothefreak Omega>Galaxy Prime is a true diagnosis.But I actually have spoken about Galaxy Prime2.0.,the map in this list.If you would compare the 2 versions of Galaxy i'm sure you will find out that is a subtantial difference between those two.And the second version of Galaxy is > than Omega,for many reasons that you can easily discover.|
|idk what is so special about GalaxyPrime?! The only thing i find nice about it is its RH3 type nat. The rest is no interesting at all. And i agree that Omega > GalaxyPrime.|
|Maps I'm currently considering:|
Close, but no.:
Reviem - would be good, but I fear the mains are too near to eachother giving Z little chance to FE.
AquaRidge - looks good, but too azaleaish and the choke from main -> nat seems horrid.
Mirage - Looks well executed, but reps on this map just won't be anything special, and I think players will find it tedious due to the lack of one truly big center/battlefield, which is needed in a semi-air map.
Jungle Raid - Only if we had 2v2. This map plays wonderful on 2v2, but I fear that it becomes too much of a macro map in 1v1.
|Btw: I think I'm going to go for one map with webs and one without, and the ones currently in my head for that are Battlegrounds 2.0 and Avatar.|
|lol your not very good at picking maps, most if not all of those maps have blatant imbalances. |
namniar, kumba, and battleground is just rofl.
nazca a lot of people think its good but im relatively sure it would be imbalanced. dont know about avatar, only played 2-3 games on it
|hm, in the topic, it says, the maps should be chosen with focus on balance and being not-experimental...so i dont see why being standard kicks out mirage, while the experimental features of avatar dont seem to count (although i REALLY like avatar, it rocks). but whatever.|
jungle raid is supposed to be 2on2, i didnt know you search for 1on1 maps.
namniar isnt balanced in my eyes, which i pointed out in the mapthread. nacza, kumba rock hard! pro those 2; only battlegrounds seems a bad choice to me, ZvT will be a bitch - only 2 exterior gasexpos for zerg, which are both easily attackable with tanks especially because he has chokepoints to keep arriving zerg troops away/splash them with tankdamage. just look at how a terran troop could splatter this island, or attack the highground expansion from below - he always sits in quite a safe tight spot. additionally, the zerg natural can be attacked from two sides, which makes A LOT of sunkens necessarily. and furthermore, if zerg builds sunkens at the natural, terran will very early in game be able to break the second route to the mainbase. i guess this will be a VERY bad choice in ZvT...
|Looking at Battlegrounds again, I suppose ZvT is hard there. Looked like a good map though.|
Don't see the problem with namniar, center reasonably open and nat good defendable.
Kumba doesn't seem too bad either. Instead of just saying rofl, how about giving arguments for your claims?
|(was a response to Inept btw, flo's post wasn't posted yet)|
|As for not experimental - I told nasty to post not TOO experimental, as in no dark swarms, lack of centers, full islands, etcetera. Disruption webs and neutral buildings are allowed, as long as the webs don't fill up the entire map.|
|What's wrong with Gefrierbrand? It's really basic and balanced and this is what was asked for.|
Tell me another map I made that fits better and I'll replace Gefrierbrand with it ~_~
|I asked for balanced and not TOO experimental, not this basic. The map has completely no personality.|
I dont dissaprove the ZvT theories as i havent played on it alot. But i will say that if the Z is aggressive in the begining (9pool --> harass/guerrilla tactics) and use the backdoor, then it can be very Z>T. I've experienced this with a few TvZ's on this map where i didnt always keep watch on my backdoor.
I'll get some games on it and see whats up :)
|It is experimental, not much but a bit. Small unit ramp,mineral chunk on the ramp, so where is the problem?!|
|How many maps are gunna be choosen in the end? Thanks for the nice comments on Kumba guys it's all I have to be proud of ^^|
|I know that it will be more work but would it be too much to request that not only the reasons for selecting a map are explained but also the reasons for not selecting one? It doesn't have to be a "map by map" thing but you can make categories for example: maps A, B and C were not selected because they were considered imbalanced, maps D and E were not selected because of pathing issues, maps F and G... etc.|
From the messages it seems that you have already made up your mind as to which maps you will even consider (and the map submission period is not even over!). I am just curious as to your thought process.
"GG.net is looking for the most balanced maps available here at bwmn."
it would seem to me then that this contest is a waste of time for most mappers. You should probably not do a contest at all, you should select from those maps that won MOTW or that have tons of replays.
|Fortitude ... this map is so nice :D|
|go go gadget undying lands|
|NastyMarine cheata: 2 maps maxi :P|
U got 3 with Batllegrounds
|that was arden's submission :) he really should get more credit for that map then me. I made the original.. but he made it sexy.|
|I like Fortitude,too.What I miss on this map is maybe the element of surprise,but the execution is good and the balance also.On the other hand Galaxy Prime is a allround-map that can provide evry game with enough elements of surprise.On this map is nothing you cant do|
|I would have to agree that Galaxy Prime is better than Fortitude, but both are really boring and conceptless maps.|
Undying Lands, er I don't think so. It's already in carrier, why waste a bwm map position with it? Don't we want as many as possible maps to be introduced from bwm into the community?
Battlegrounds I really like. What I don't like about it is how lethal the backdoor is. I have not found zvt to be hard at all from playing the map. What I do dislike is how far the nat is from the main, now with nothing else I would not find this to be a problem, but that backdoor makes defending both bases a bitch, I mean the backdoor into the main. The nat is perfectly easy to defend, atleast as z imo. But it's too easy to do so many simultaneous attacks on both nat and main, with several entrances to the nat and main, it can get overwhelming very early on.
|Space in Hell isn't a bad choice imo, neither is Sleeping Sun Final. I like the Triskalion, but since it just is just a good (3)Gaia, it doesn't offer the best of bwm.|
Kumba wouldn't be bad, but we have better here.
I don't really see anything on the list so far which catches my eye. If we had to vote now, I'd say BattleGrounds2.0 But that backdoor imo is too easy to break through, but! it is repairable, and so far although I haven't seen that come in handy too much, it certainly will if it goes into a place with players who know how to play. idk, maybe make the backdoor a 2000hp thing and a 5000 hp thing, the 2000 one could be repaired, and the 5000 thing will last long enough.
I love Avatar, but that might already be in under the experimental map category, if he picks two.
We should try not to give them a map we already know to be unbalanced, as in, not Mirage lol...
Nazca, Undying, Avatar, Kumba, Aquaridge, have already been shown to the community. Also, when I showed the community BattleGrounds, they didn't care for it, although I believe they are mistaken in their assumptions of the map.
Indolence and Triskalion are just variations on a familiar theme, ie just another Luna and Gaia.
Galaxy Prime and Fortitudes are just laughs when it comes to originality, no reason to send them =/
BattleOnChar isn't bad, but idk if it has the flare needed for a map like this.
|The other maps there: Reviem, distances are very short from playing experience, and it was already on gg.net|
Namniar, lol I don't like this map, I find nothing appealing about it, and I think it has balance issues/awkwardness to it, not having played it myself.
Jungle Raid is nice, but it's not my cup of coffee =/
Rocket is unappealing concept-wise, and looks awkward to play, even paths to boot.
Outpost lacks flare and balance imo.
I guess Oracular is nice, but it looks horribly awkward and fairly random in its execution.
Krator is ok but looks awkward and not my cup of coffee again.
Scout's snow map is nice, but idk if it's special enough to get anywhere, its concept is nice and playable, but not unique, how about a playable and unique map? Now that's the trick, isn't it :)
|o and I do like Sleeping Sun, idk if the players will though.|
Yeah, Nautilus is definitely good, you uploaded that as I was writing =/
Definitely guys check out the older maps, many of them pwn, and it's been a long time since we released those map packs, why not show them those maps again?
|ok I added a few :)|
|Can someone give me admin rights? Will make things a bit easier.|
|found strife looking through, looks balanced.|
|As experimental maps obviously DO count in this competition (whatever the topic says), i withdrew my 2 first entries and submitted Naja and AwokenDemons.|
|lol, I don't like Strife at all, but w/e. That random expo in media res is just zomg -.-|
I like AwokenDemons, but I don't like Naja. AwokenDemons wouldn't be a bad choice...
|I love those Competitions on BWMN. "Balance is key here. So experimental maps are not the greatest choice" "I asked for balanced and not TOO experimental, not this basic."|
Hell yeah! Balance is the key, so make it experimental with Thousands of neutral buildings, minerals blocking every path and 5mineral blocks in the main base! Balance MADNESS!
phew. I just love it. ^^
|lol ever and always the cynic scout :)|
|actually a map like that sounds pretty balanced, ill get to it|
|i posthed (3)the trislakion and no1 sayd a single thing about it... so i tought it was a very very bad map (gaia for 3 players)|
so i decided to make a new map: (3)LG
it's a desert map with 3 diferent sets: peaks baekdu + neo arkanoid and a normal map(lost temple, gaia, etc) ramps are smaler so it can be closed with 2 zlots (like jungle ramps)
it have no doodads because it's not finished.
anyway, i have unitil april 1th to finish it.
please, if that map sux tell me! "testbug, both triskalion and Lg are really bad"
PD: at least see the pictures :(
|Um Nazca was just named MOTY & turned into a WCG map, what more does it need oO :D|
|Nazca WCG map? Seriously? oO|
But tk is right about Nazca not needing to be used again -_-
Testbug, I think we all like Triskalion, it's a nice map, but it offers nothing new, since it is just a good (3)Gaia. As for LG, I don't think it could become a map for the Starleague since it has such a radical concept with three different gameplay variations in one map; positionally I don't think it's balanced perfectly, but I could be wrong. But I don't think it will be accepted by players very readily for having possibly unstable gameplay... eh idk I'm rambling, it certainly is a nice and different map :)
|I've only got one thing to say.|
|I ment WGT lmao but yeah its in the wgtour.com database as for the map LG I really dont understand it|
|o it got wgt? cool; btw I looked on tl for the wcg thing, and apparently the only new map is baekdu (neo apparently, yay!), and they kept the old shitty maps (azalea, gaia, PA(WTF I hate that map)|
|lmao wtf artanis|
|THIS IS PASTAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA|
|hm i fear i wont have enough reps besides i cant upload newr version of my maps these days (upload speed 0,05 - hell yeah brave new world)|
|well i finally submitted those|
|LOL when i read what the clip said i bursted out laughing XD thanks lex, now i look like an idiot in my intro to video game class.|
|lol pwnd ezzzzzzz|
hahahahaha the more i look on it the more i forget what he originally said
|Going to get a few good players to playtest the maps I feel have potential to join the starleague 2.|
|well I finaly thought of what I should upload for my 2nd map here Lysis gogo imo & all of my teams opinion my 2nd best map|
|experimental maps are not the greatest choice|
so, remove LG wich is totaly experimental, and Triskalion is only (3)gaia.
Rocky Ground is my last hope ;)
(i'll remove the 9 o'click tree today)
|I have one submission. I won't say what my chances are but I hope Artanis likes it enough to consider it :)|
Satellite 85's design in the middle is very much like Neo POB, but the pathing is made differently as well as the terrain (Space). Sprites have been added to spice up the map so it's not your standard map (kinda the new thing now though that everyone's experimenting with sprites and neutrals but you get what I was trying to say :P).
|Some think it's a geometry/paeks mix but better :)|
|Today is 4-10 voting should start GoGo|
|who voted Satellite 85???|
if i'm not wrong, that's the worst map in the list :S
well well, i would like to vote for my own maps, like Triskalion, since i spend a lot of time and efford there, but as nightmarjoo sayd, it doesn't offers nothing new, it's just gaia for 3 players.
anyway it's more beautifull :P
AquaRidge may not be that good but it's still one of my favorites (i don't like the distances from main to nat, nat doesn't close the choke, and can't wall in) center area is like azalea, so doesn't it offers nothing new?
hey! fortitude looks good! but come on! what are those expos at the bridge?
what are those black spots at lysis??
anyway, that map is fine but i would remove the 2 expos in the center high ground, and that the hell are those power generators at NE and SW for?
i prefere traditional structures like nomad but those natural expo mineral lines are quite bad, hard to defend and easy to harras, that secure expo is not secure! anyway,nomad is one of my favorites.
Space Lotus is only a damn good map, but doesn't looks funny and i would't download it :P
Oracular Visions has a very good structure, but that size makes it some complicated or far; i want to use that scetch to make a smaller version of it. i don't like disruption webs anyway.
almost but no:
Sleeping Sun Final MOTY? i don't think so
Indolence = Luna?
don't like Kuma min-only and doesn't looks funny
Galaxy Prime? oh it looks like (4)Rush hour!
oh, wait a second... 2.0????
never saw the 1st version.
ok no, tell me, is averybody able to vote?
so i can create a lot of accounts and vote for Rocky Ground?
who the hell voted for Satellite 85???!!!!!!!
|@testbug scroll down|
|sorry i did not knew what does "scroll down" means, so i scrolled down and read 2 people voted for nazca; now we'll never know who was it.|
i don't know whhy is nazca that good. is it well balanced? maybe it is that i don't like the center. but i can't understand how did it become a WGT map and probably a WCG map.
i found it too macro-style; maybe it is because i prefer low mineral maps more micro oriented.
i know all of you knows a lot about map balance, can anyone explains me why it nazca so good?
maybe it's only that i don't like it, or i hate it; well, it's not beautifull.
i mean a starleague map must be a map that makes all of us say HOLY SHIT! it must be a beautifull map, but the best tlking about gameplay and balance thigs. the movement between purple and teal is not natural.
i tought it was a bad map when i watch it for 1st time, but then evrybody sayd it was the best thing here. i found mains too small, or at least the teal is.
a good map would be (4)Sacred Grounds 2.1 look at the mains! Temple followed by Raised Jungle the center is quite good but minonly sux (map id: 1218)
i think Artanis is not looking for maps like Luna; i thing starleague needs a beautiful map like Longinus.
if Artanis chose a shit map like Luna, then it must be a beaufitul one like (4)LunaTheSpace2.1
(map id: 1374)
the best maps in my opinion are those i mentioned in my last post. (but i'm sure Triskalion and Rocky Ground are better xD)
|If starleague wanted to use Nazca they could just get it from wgtour.com lol|
|Greedy Weakness GOGOGOGO|
|whoa Greedy Weakness looks sweet but i'm worried about the size of the mains.|
|I think you scared Alumni testbug :O|
Also, please don't flame the map of a new mapper "worst map on the list", especially without providing some possibly helpful critiques so that he may possibly better his map, and make in the future better maps.
But to those who voted for Nazca, it's already wgt map, why make it Starleague map when we could have a different and possibly better one? -.-
Space Lotus is a great map.
idk about which map I'd want in the starleague, I'll think about it tomorow, too tired atm, it's 4:30 am =/
|illusion and AwDe are my maps now. updated illusion is better than unupdated Naja.|
|"But to those who voted for Nazca, it's already wgt map, why make it Starleague map when we could have a different and possibly better one? -.-" -Joel|
yes yes agreed, & wow voting for competitions are at an all time high this month or something
|oh, sorry nightmarjoo, sorry alumni :(|
but, are we alowed to vote? i mean, Alumni is en extremely new, new mapper; RaDiX has abouta 24 unfinished maps, and i have only 3 but eberybody here hates LG so i have only 2 maps.
we don't know too much about mapping, so, why is our opinion valid?
(look, they both voted for Nazca) if starleague wanted nazca, the woiuld already chosen it! it is in the WGT map pack! so if they did not.
let's give'em a new broodwarmaps.net map!
one more thing: what's wrong about Lysis?
it looks ok but i don't know why doesn't it convice me; i'll vote for rocky ground :P
|@testbug: voting is not necessary in this competition because artanis picks the winner|
but generally spoken: why shouldnt your votes count? we know you, Alumni and RaDiX, i see no point in excluding you from the voting process Oo
the more votes the more likely it is that comments will be generated - the more comments the more information about the map :P
|No1 should really vote... its all up to LaO-Artanis|
|thanks LostTampon, i jumped the gun and wanted to see how well the voting system worked, so when the votes are reset i'm actually considering these three maps:|
(4)Space Lotus 1.1
(4)Stairs II 2.0
I like 4 player maps because then it makes scouting more important in early game :)
|oh thats a good reason to pick a map |
|Voting is fine, might affect my decision so I suggest you do it regardless.|
|umm tk, that's not the only reason i picked those maps.|
|alumni the problem is the unnamed one's votes, who doesnt comment on any map and even if they do they are not showing great balancing skills.|
at first, tk and radix was also extremely newbie mapmaker, but with the great deal of mapmaking work they showed, they got more experience which we respect or whatever :)
|well i'm not that worried about it, choices always change and Artanis has the last say :)|
|Maps selected for testing:|
The other maps are most likely not going to be selected for the season, but the testers are free to choose them and play them anyhow. I'd appreciate it if all these maps get an observer version though.
|Btw, current map testing team:|
G5, Mireille, Push, Octzerg, Quirion, and Ptak.
|(Waits for drama of mappers that didn't get a test to unfold)|
|just from that list, i'd scrap battlegrounds/namniar. wonder if the testers will agree. Romanov standoff was not that great, but Romanov Sanctum is a bit better. still think zerg will have a very difficult time on it.|
|I don't like Namniar at all. I agree with Avatar/Battlegrounds, Nomad and Sanctum are ok though.|
|That's why they will be tested. Three maps will be scrapped at least, and possibly a fourth. Most likely going to be two maps of that list though, and most likely Avatar/Namniar and Battlegrounds/Nomad/Romanov Sanctum.|
|TuZeR and PredY added to testing team.|
|woah nice testing team :)|
out of the list you're testing though, i hope battlegrounds and nomad make it.
|Alumni, might find some solace in that Mount Shakuras was definately not bad and even considered for testing, but eventually disregarded to only have 5 maps for testing.|
|RED, SAUCE, ON, PASTA!|
|that's cool Artanis, there's always going to be more opportunities. i only voted between the list of maps that were selected for testing.|
|So what's up so far? Have they been testing the maps? Do we get to see comments/replays? Would be very helpful...|
|LaO-Artanis why won't you consider this maps?|
-(3)The Triskalion 0.95
-(4)Sacred Grounds 2.1
you haven't say anything about Lysis and it is damn perfect.
Feed SomeBodySSoul is one of the most profesional maps i have ever seen (this is a more micro oriented map)
|Lysis is p>t|
FeedSomebodySSoul is t>z p>t
Triskalion is (3)gaia
sacred grounds is nice in the pic but not so nice in game, and it's pretty boring
lol lunathespace is luna
|Thanks Nightmarajoo, I'll answer them too.|
Lysis seems to have an interesting concept, but the gameplay will be reasonably standard, with the addons probably not getting used much, if at all due to players not caring much about playing these maps in the first season most likely.
FeedSomebodySSoul is a PAIN for ZvT, and expansions are generally too open, which makes it much easier for Protoss mostly, though they might still get owned by Zerg.
The triskalion is your own map, and is nothing special. Shouldn't give some biased maps.
Sacred Grounds is a nice map in concept, and the picture looks great, but the gameplay just isn't anything out of the ordinary and troop movement from your main to outside of your natural is a PAIN.
Lunathespace is n/c.
|lol sorry Artanis, you're not always active, and I like talking^^|
|it was probably a better choice anyways not to have chosen mount shakuras because alot of minor modifications have been made to it to make the nat defendable rather than too hard to secure.|
|maybe testing by other ppl on this site then just me on Lysis should be done oO|
|you can chose Lysis because it is beautifull and then modoify it so it gets more balanced.|
send the feedback so tktkvroom can edit it.
PD: tktkvroom i want Xellos back too
|what about xellos now? Reach>Xellos what what? :D|
|We should do more testing on EVERYTHING...Or at least play the map a few times before we vote for it (which will happen anyway, doesn't much matter.)|
However, like Artanis said, we should be playing these, and considering people actually DO vote...
Perhaps we should get some good replays on these maps, see if they're playable...or get some 300 apm gosus on them ;o
|Of sure one admin map win again. Wellcome to corrupt practices.|
|is this over artanis? if yes which map made it?|
|It's not over yet. My maptest team is being lazy and the first season isn't over yet. Once the season is over, the two maps will be selected.|
|i like how Scout always complains about non ramp maps and maps with more then 1 entrance then he picks Krator as 3rd choice which has both rofl^^|
|I just voted the map under my maps. Just random pick ~_~|
|Which is exactly why your votes will not be taken seriously|
|i like Romanov Sanctum|
|Battlegrounds 2.3 and Avatar will be the maps played in GGSL season 2.|
-Nomad didn't cut it due to having no true outstanding quality, though a very solid map.
-Romanov Sanctum is still too new and has not been tested enough. Our map testers were also too lazy to do anything about this. Perhaps in season 3!
-Namniar had too much expansions for a 1on1 map. It would definitely be taken for any 2v2 league, though.
|Cool. Do we get to see all the tester reps? And/or see their commentary?|
|grat nasty, arden and losttampon. i failed to do so. ^^|
|Antares make a new gosu map then :)|